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Forums Forums Sports Media Discussion Daily Discussion Threads 7/29/2019 – 8/4/2019 Weekly Discussion Thread

This topic contains 186 replies, has 26 voices, and was last updated by  02062 2 months, 2 weeks ago.

Viewing 25 posts - 51 through 75 (of 187 total)
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  • #141485

    02062
    Participant

    How does that phrase go? Love something as much as the Boston media loves Bill Parcells?

    Or the ’67 Red Sox. I never understand that battlecry and how it ‘changed everything!’ They didn’t win, and then didn’t make the post season for another 8 years, then another 11 years after that. Wouldn’t it be more accurate to say from a franchise history perspective that the ’04 team ‘changed everything’ and 3 additional teams have won championships since? Weirdo baby boomers.

    The media loves Parcells because he played them perfectly. Act like a red ass then treat a couple of guys like they’re your buddy in on the jokes and they’ll write about you glowingly forever.

    The Sox might have moved if they hadn’t won the pennant in ’67 according to High Pants and the like.

     

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    #141486

    Big Fat O
    Participant

    Parcells gave the overall media as much as BB but seemed friendlier to some of them compared to BB and that is why he’s revered around here.

    #141487

    Danny Duberstein
    Participant

    Babbo in the C-Port is closing.  I guess they couldn’t live without the

    #141488

    02062
    Participant

    Babbo in the C-Port is closing. I guess they couldn’t live without the

    Related image

    #141489

    jforb
    Participant

    Calf sidelines Luck but Achilles ‘not at extra risk’

    Over/under for related stories in the next 2 years set at the number of shoulder stories from the last 2?

    #141490

    Lebron
    Participant

    Brackens was who I was thinking of as Parcells choice at that spot.

    So the ‘impossible dream’ was to be the runner-up?  I never understood that.  Like all the same folks who go on and on about Jimmy Connors in ’91 at the US Open.  He made the semifinals and got smoked.  yet you ask a Lupica type and they’ll wax poetic about the magic of it all.  You’d think they actually won something other than ‘our hearts!’

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    #141491

    Didn’t Parcells say he wish he handled things differently in The Two Bills doc? Ryan had some snide remark like ‘Mr. Kraft thought he knew more about football than Parcells.’ Parcells always went with I was hired by a different owner and the new owner wanted to do things differently. I never got the impression that Kraft thought he knew more about football than Parcells or ever said anything publicly like that like what Jerry Jones did with Jimmy Johnson. In fact he publicly stated that Parcells was the best coach when they were handed the Hunt trophy. Kraft definitely wanted to run the football business differently, namely he wanted a separation of power between the coach and GM and Parcells wanted more say with the roster if not absolute say. Kraft didn’t want to give him that and was fine with shortening the contract. Heck I’d say Kraft doesn’t get enough credit for those decisions. 90% of owners would have just given Parcells whatever he wanted.

    Does anyone know who Parcells would have taken instead of Terry Glenn in ’96? He certainly didn’t want Glenn and that’s when it seemed like it all started.

    From McDonough’s breakup story:

    On the eve of the draft, about 5 p.m., I called Kraft in his Boston office and asked whom he intended to pick in the first round.

    “Well, it all depends on who is there,” he said, “but my boys” — Parcells and Grier — “tell me we’re going to take a defensive lineman.

    “There’s three guys we’re interested in. Cedric Jones. Duane Clemons. Tony Brackens. We’ll have a shot at one of those three.”

    Within 30 minutes of that conversation, I called Parcells and told him what Kraft said. “That’s right,” he answered. “One of those defensive linemen. That’s where we need the help. We stink on defense.”

    First of all, how crazy is it that they just told reporters who they planned to take? What a competitive disadvantage. The Giants took Jones at 5, so the Pats couldn’t grab him. I believe Parcells’ narrative changed later on, after Brackens broke out some, that he was the guy they were targeting all along.

    With the first three championships, the press liked to say Belichick “won with Parcells’ guys” – pointing to draftees like Law, McGinest, Milloy, Bruschi and Johnson, plus UFA Vinatieri. But Parcells himself said he wasn’t in the room when Milloy and Bruschi were drafted. And Kraft rightly was trying reduce Parcells’ role after Parcells rolled out some real duds in FA. From an SI article in ’96:

    For three years he had given Parcells free rein to pick whatever players he wanted in the draft and to sign whichever free agents he needed. In 1994 New England shelled out more than $10 million for free-agent defensive backs Myron Guyton and Ricky Reynolds. Last year the Patriots signed scatback Dave Meggett to a five-year, $10 million deal. Guyton was released in March, Reynolds is on his last legs with the team, and Meggett scored just two touchdowns in ’95. Tired of having his money wasted, Kraft reduced Parcells’s authority in personnel decisions last January and made player personnel director Bobby Grier the team’s de facto general manager.

    Meggett (that rapist scumbag) did have some production in ’96, but the SI article was right: Parcells tended to overpay mid-level guys or pay for past performance. He brought in a ton of ex-Giants, but nobody of any real note save for Meggett and William Roberts. He also took a lot of fliers on guys well past their prime like Marion Butts, Mike Pitts and Aaron Jones.

    The media wanted to champion everything about Parcells, but I think the truth is that scouting and free agency were not his strengths.

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    #141492

    Brackens was who I was thinking of as Parcells choice at that spot.

    So the ‘impossible dream’ was to be the runner-up? I never understood that. Like all the same folks who go on and on about Jimmy Connors in ’91 at the US Open. He made the semifinals and got smoked. yet you ask a Lupica type and they’ll wax poetic about the magic of it all. You’d think they actually won something other than ‘our hearts!’

    The ’51 Giants won the pennant, but lost to the Yankees in the Series in six games. One iconic radio call (and BTW, Bobby Thomson was tipped off to what pitch was coming, Spygate truthers), and you have the precursor to all the Colts’ AFC Championship participant banners.

    #141493

    chicowalker
    Participant

    scatback Dave Meggett

    a girl I went to HS with was one of Meggett’s hooahs, so much so that she had his last name tattooed on her leg.  If he decided to use his position listed above as a means of spicing up the ol’ love life, she’d have been game

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    #141494

    jforb
    Participant

    Finn put up a question about Parcells. One of the comments

    … I’m going to settle on “yes” – because of the “instant credibility” and how the team DID turn around and start playing like a respectable franchise (new uniforms helped a lot, too).

    The uniforms had prevented them from being respectable? :blink:

    #141495

    Lebron
    Participant

    I don’t remember if Bledsoe got hurt in ’95?  They went from 10-6 to 6-10 then back to 10-6 in his last year.

    #141496

    Lebron
    Participant

    I hate to say it but pretty much all the owners and coaches cozied up to national guys like McDonough.  And many still do.  It sickens me to say but I don’t doubt Pete has pretty much league wide access and everyone on speed dial save for Bill.  So that draft stuff doesn’t entirely surprise me.  I also don’t think that many of the owners or coaches thought enough about it.  Bill might be the only guy that doesn’t see an advantage or any appeal to having a national or local writer on his side so to speak.  He got so much shit in Cleveland, distancing yourself from them can’t be any worse.

    One thing I noticed was when Bill was at the podium talking to the press about his involvement in the NFL Films project, he really did take a “I’m just here so I don’t get fined” disdainful approach in his answer.  And it’s probably because he hates each and every cocksucker in that room.  My thought is if he was talking to Berman, he would have been noticeably more enthusiastic in talking about it.

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    #141497

    02062
    Participant

    Oh Waxpack, you’ve done it again.

    “Anyone making the argument that he was just a .500 coach here (32-32) needs a serious history lesson.”

    Anyone citing Parcells’s .500 record as a reason to keep him out doesn’t know their history.”

    But 20 years into this dynasty, the perspective on his time here should be clear. Parcells developed players who formed the foundation of the first phase of the dynasty”

    #141498

    Coma
    Participant

    Oh Waxpack, you’ve done it again.

    “Anyone making the argument that he was just a .500 coach here (32-32) needs a serious history lesson.”

    Anyone citing Parcells’s .500 record as a reason to keep him out doesn’t know their history.”

    But 20 years into this dynasty, the perspective on his time here should be clear. Parcells developed players who formed the foundation of the first phase of the dynasty”

    Maybe I’ve missed the stories, but I don’t recall the media championing Jim Fassel for developing the players (Strahan, Umenyiora, Tyree) who formed the foundation of Coughlin’s Super Bowl teams.

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    #141499

    Lebron
    Participant

    Brandt and Landry drafted Michael Irvin so they’re basically responsible for the Cowboys success in the 90s

    2 users thanked author for this post.
    #141500

    Kingasaurus
    Participant

    Look, I’m beating a dead horse.

    I agree with every criticism people have of Parcells – I’ve been making all of them myself to counter Twitter dopes all day. But Finn is right that the “.500 coach” thing is an unfair use of statistics. If you take over a shitty team and turn them around, you’re going to have losses piling up on the front end. He took over the League’s worst team and had them in the playoffs in 2 years and the Super Bowl in four. They overachieved in year 2, underachieved in year 3. Fair enough. But just saying “32-32!” is factually accurate but misleading.

    Doesn’t change the fact that the idiots clamoring for him to be in the Pats HOF are clueless morons.

     

    #141501

    Big Fat O
    Participant

    Finn is another drinking the Parcells koolaid. BB and Groh, Weis and the other coordinators developed the players. Parcells knew how to develop a team and motivate players.

    If Finn really believes it was Parcells who drafted Bruschi without input from BB he’s really dumb. BB had a lot of input here on personnel but deflects the credit to Parcells out of respect.

    Sadly I don’t think BB is the type to write a tell all, but if he did it would be glorious.

    #141502

    Lefty
    Moderator

    One thing I noticed was when Bill was at the podium talking to the press about his involvement in the NFL Films project, he really did take a “I’m just here so I don’t get fined” disdainful approach in his answer. And it’s probably because he hates each and every cocksucker in that room. My thought is if he was talking to Berman, he would have been noticeably more enthusiastic in talking about it.

    You’re right – I heard him on Satellite with Jim Miller and Pat Kirwan and when they asked him about the NFL films thing he Gabe a wide ranging answer and talked about how honored  he was, etc.    when asked,, also said that in his mind, LT is “in the top 1” of the greatest of all time discussion

    #141503

    Hacksaw
    Participant

    Does Belichick get credit for winning with Pete Carroll’s guys?

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by  Hacksaw.
    #141505

    Feejis
    Participant

    Look, I’m beating a dead horse.

    I agree with every criticism people have of Parcells – I’ve been making all of them myself to counter Twitter dopes all day. But Finn is right that the “.500 coach” thing is an unfair use of statistics. If you take over a shitty team and turn them around, you’re going to have losses piling up on the front end. He took over the League’s worst team and had them in the playoffs in 2 years and the Super Bowl in four. They overachieved in year 2, underachieved in year 3. Fair enough. But just saying “32-32!” is factually accurate but misleading.

    Doesn’t change the fact that the idiots clamoring for him to be in the Pats HOF are clueless morons.

    It’s just one data point. Nobody uses it as their sole argument, but to deny it’s a factor is wilfull blindness.

    BB had a bad first year here also but he didn’t backslide to a 6 win season the first time he had to play a 1st place schedule.

    #141506

    Danny Duberstein
    Participant

    Yes, Meggett is a complete sociopath, and deserves every bit of punishment he receives

     

    But strictly by the numbers, this is a high motor rapist. Is he a Golden state Killer/East area Rapist?  No, GSK/EAR/ONS is singular in the rape community. But Meggett belongs in the rape HOF, on offensive efficiency alone. He turned every touch he got as rapey as it could be.

    #141507

    Yahtzee
    Participant

    EEI’s fresh new morning show’s guest right now … Lenny Clarke!

    #141508

    Big Fat O
    Participant

    I doubt Hill man is going to make a dent to 98.5 in the ratings and T&R suck.

    Fraudway thought talking about Lebrons parenting skills was a good topic to light up the phone lines.

    #141509

    02062
    Participant

    MLB Deadline Day – Catch The Fever!

    #141510

    Lefty
    Moderator

    MLB Deadline Day – Catch The Fever!

    Insert. “Red Sox were in on everything” here.

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